91: How to Make the Most of Landing Your Dream Podcast Guest

This is Grow the Show, the podcast to help you grow your podcast. My name is Kevin Schmidland and in this episode, I am going to share with you how you can maximize landing a dream guest for your podcast. It is a moment that we crave as podcasters who feature guests on our show pretty much from the moment of inception when we have the idea for our show. We have a dream guest or maybe a few dream guests in mind where we're like, man, it would be so cool if I could interview this person. Well luckily for a lot of us, we do get that opportunity and we can all have that opportunity if you know how to do it and know how to get in touch and make the ask. And so I have seen many Grow the Show podcasters land their dream guests but I've also seen many of them be unhappy with what happened after they got their dream guest. So what I want to talk about today is specifically how you can maximize landing a dream guest for your show. And I'm going to start by telling a story of a Grow the Show podcaster who posted in the Grow the Show Facebook group. This person recently featured an absolute dream guest of theirs, somebody who is a national celebrity with a recognizable name. So this Grow the Show podcaster posted a screenshot of their download numbers just eight days after publishing the episode with their dream guest. And what did they say? They said they were disappointed. They said that the opportunity to feature this person was not the career altering opportunity that they thought it would be and so they were pretty upset. Here's the thing. If you look at their download numbers on the episodes before and the episodes after with the dream guest, the episode with the dream guest had double the amount of downloads that any other episode prior hat. So even though publishing an episode with their dream guests doubled their downloads between one episode and the next, this podcaster was extremely disappointed and upset to the point where they came to the Grow the Show Facebook group to express their level of sadness. Now if you are listening to this and this is you, you know who you are and what's awesome is that once you posted this screenshot of your discontent, the Grow the Show community was right there saying, what are you talking about? This is awesome. And in the comments, you were a totally great sport, you were wonderful about it and you took the coaching great to keep your chin up and see this opportunity for what it really is. So I commend you. If you're listening, you know who you are and I extremely respect number one that you shared this in the Grow the Show group and number two, how you responded when the whole community was like, what are you talking about? This is awesome. That said, what happened to this podcaster is something that's extremely common. They fell trap to the belief that we all have before we feature a big name guest for the first time, which is this man, once I have X person on the show, the show is going to blow up overnight, it's going to go viral. My show is going to grow like crazy. I'm going to get tons of their audience and I will have made it. We all believe that at some point until we feature that first dream guest and in most cases, nothing happens. So this particular podcaster that I'm talking about saw their downloads double from one episode to the next, which was significant, by the way, they went from 1500 downloads to 3000 and that was only eight days after the episode dropped. That is massive. In most cases, there is no change in download numbers when a dream guest gets features. And why is that? Because it's extremely rare that the dream guests actually share your podcast episode with their audience. And if you think about it, it makes sense because that dream guest is somebody that has a massive audience and they are on podcasts all the time. If they told their audience every single time they got featured on another show, all they would ever be doing is posting to their audience. Well, listen to this podcast, go listen to that podcast, go listen to this podcast. And what doesn't help things is that vast majority of podcasters ask these people the same questions over and over and over again. So it's not even a unique interview. Now I'm not saying the specific podcasters that I'm talking about, that is the case. I haven't heard their interview with their dream guest, but that is often the case that podcasters, uh, gland a dream guest get them asking the same questions that dream guest has ever been asked before. And so not only is that dream guest not going to share with their audience because they can't share every single podcast that they're on because their audience will get tired of that. But also generally it's not a new and interesting interview anyway. So this is what usually happens. They get a yes from their dream guest. They're over the moon excited. They prepare it. They feature the dream guest. They publish the episode, crickets, nothing changes and that podcasters dream of their show blowing up quote unquote overnight is dashed and many people are super discouraged by that. What can you do then to truly maximize landing a dream guest on your podcast? Well, what I'm about to share fits into two buckets of advice, two buckets of what you can do. The first bucket is what you can do to actually get that person to share and actually get your audience to grow from featuring that guest. Uh, and the second bucket is the stuff that you might not actually be considering and I would argue most podcasters don't think to do, which is where the true opportunity is with landing these a list guests. So let's start with the first one. The first question is how can I utilize landing a dream guest on my podcast to actually get more listeners and to grow my audience? This episode of Grow the Show is sponsored by Riverside.fm, the leading platform to record studio quality podcasts. More than 70,000 other podcasters use Riverside, including myself, Guy Ross, Gary Vee, Spotify, and even the New York Times Riverside is not only great because it has unbelievably high recording quality regardless of your or your guests internet quality, but it also gives you separate audio and video tracks for each person speaking. It's high tech, but easy to use. Unlike zoom, you don't have to have anything installed on your computer and your guests don't either. Did I mention that the audio quality is way better? If you're recording your interviews remotely, get off of zoom now and hop into Riverside for your next interview. Your listeners will thank you. Head over to Riverside.fm and use code Grow that's GROW to get 60 free minutes of recording and 15% off a membership plan. The link is in the show notes. So here's what to do in no particular order when you land a dream guest. You want to be organized. You want to impress this person with your level of organization. You want to be precisely on time when it's time for the interview. You want to not reschedule. Rescheduling is one of the most amateur things that amateur podcasters do when they land a big name. They reschedule for any reason, unless you know there's some true, true, true emergency which is rare. But the other thing is that many amateur podcasters are not organized. It's not clear what that person should expect when they come into the interview. It's annoying to book time. They'll send that person a calendar link that requires them to fill out a three page form like you're going to the doctor. Things like that are not organized. You want to be super organized. You want to make it easy for them to say yes and easy for them to show up and be interviewed. Make it the easiest experience they've ever had. Then complete the interview. Ask them questions that they have not been asked before. So as you keep the questions that every podcaster asks, so how did you get started in this? What do you think is the best advice for success? Like those things they've been asked a billion times are tired of answering them. If instead you do your research and ask good thoughtful questions that are truly from your place of curiosity and not you trying to just be an impressive interviewer, the dream guest is going to be impressed. And then when the interview is over, you want to ask them two key questions. Number one is what would be the best way for me to share the content that we've created today with your audience? What would be the best way for us to share the content that we've created today with your audience? See what they say and leave it open ended like that. Some of them will say we should create a TikTok or real or YouTube short. We could create a short form video. Others will say I can share it with my email list, right? Others might say I'll share it on my podcast feed. Now the first thing you want to do is ask that question in an open ended fashion and see what they say. If they say something right away, do that and do it well. So if they say, oh, if you make a real, I'll share it. Great. I'm going to go out and hire a really good real maker to edit an incredible real that they can share on their feed. If they say email, I'm going to make sure I write an email for them. And if they say they'll share it on their feed, I will make it really easy for them to do that. And that's step two. Ask them what way would be the best way to share this content with their audience? And whatever they say, do it for them and do it well. And in a way that matches their online presence. So if there's somebody who posts short form videos, then make it look like the short form videos that they post. Now if they don't answer that question, sometimes they'll get a little squirmy. And if they do, it's okay. They've already given you an hour of their time, which is unbelievably generous. And so if they get squirmy and they're like, I'm not really sure. Then what's happening there is probably, it's not a reflection of you. It's more a reflection of other podcasts that they've been on where the podcaster has tried to back them into the corner of promising that they'll share their terrible audiogram that's super ugly and doesn't match their social media online presence. So if these dream guests get a little flighty, when you ask them to share with their audience, that's okay. Make them feel safe and make them know that it's okay if they don't share with their audience at all because they've already done you a favor, right? They don't owe it to you to share with their audience, okay? Now they might also respond, thoughtfully saying, hmm, I'm not really sure, but they, you know, convey that they might be interested in willing to share with their audience. If that's the case, what I would recommend is suggesting the thing that's best for you. And so in most cases, that's going to be, if that person has a podcast, suggest that you share this interview that we just did, share this episode of your podcast on their feet. That is my favorite hack. That's something that's growing in popularity, especially with bigger name guests because they're learning that they can go get featured on other podcasts, then they can share that interview on their own podcast and they get content to share about themselves. You get the benefit of getting exposure to their podcast feed their audience. You can do the same thing if they're someone who is primarily with an email list and likewise on social media. So if they're not sure, when you ask them, hey, how can we share this content with your audience, then suggest it. And you also have, you know, permission. What I'll often do is if I know that I'm talking to somebody who has a podcast, who there's a good chance they would be willing to share my episode of them on their feed. I'll just cut right to that. I'll be like, Hey, we're going to put a ton of work into editing this episode. It's going to be really good. You're going to sound awesome. Would you consider sharing the final episode on your podcast feed? And phrase it like that. Don't ask, would you share it on your feed? Ask them, would you consider sharing it on their feed? Because then it's way safer for them to say, yes, I would consider that. And you haven't backed them into the corner to get a yes. Which is way softer, way easier to get a yes that way, okay? And then of course, if they tell you that they're going to share, number one, make it as easy for them to do that as possible, enable them as best you can. And number two, understand that a lot of them will tell you that because they're there with you in person and they don't want to say no to you in person, but actually don't intend to do that. And they're human beings. They're not perfect. It's okay. That happens. Don't get all offended if they do that. It's a common thing. It's not personal. How you maximize audience growth is number one, biggest advice is to see if they have a podcast, if they'll share your final episode on their feed. If you're going to ask that, you better make it good, you better edit, you better cut to the chase, better not be a bad interview. But that's a really great way to swap podcast audiences. And otherwise, ask them the best way to share and whatever they tell you, do it. So that's how you can maximize audience growth as you feature a dream guest. But even then, it's common that nothing will happen, that they won't share and that you won't really notice any difference immediately right away in your download numbers by featuring this guest. And remember, that makes sense. Your show is not plastered on the front page of newspapers or on the homepage of Instagram or TikTok or Twitter. When you feature this person on your show, nobody's going to know unless you or that person tells everybody, right? So just keep that in mind. It's not going to be this thing that just blows up overnight. And here's how to really, in my opinion, how to really maximize landing an A-list guest, a dream guest on your podcast. Here's the key thing to understand. When you feature a big name, recognizable guest on your podcast, once you feature just one of those A-list guests, then that unlocks your ability to feature other A-list guests. Because if you make a list of 100 dream guests of your show, before you feature a any of them, only like maybe two to three of those people would be willing to come on your show while you're a new, unproven podcast. But once one of them does, that unlocks another collection of like five, ten, maybe even fifteen other dream guests who ordinarily would tell you no, but once they find out that the other dream guest that you had was also on your show and that you landed that person, they're like, oh, well, if they'll come on the show, I'll come on the show. So that unlocks that echelon of dream guests. Then suddenly you've had five dream guests and then you can approach others and say, look at these five people that I've had and then it becomes a no-brainer to come on your show and it actually flips and it makes them credible to be on your show. That is a magic place to be. That does not happen, however, overnight. So what you want to do to really maximize and squeeze the most juice out of the lemon when you do land an amazing guest is number one, have patience. Keep in mind that by featuring that dream guest, you have unlocked a new tier of other dream guests who would have otherwise told you no, but now we'll tell you, yes. And so I would immediately, as soon as that dream guest is featured, start inviting other dream guests, especially because the first dream guests episode is so recent. See, gives you a boost. So if you say, hey, I just had dream guest on my show last week, that will give you a little bit of a boost and even more possibility that your other dream guests will say yes. In addition to that, if you have sponsors or if you ever want to have sponsors in the future, you'll want to tell those sponsors that you featured this a-list guests. So it'll not only give you credibility with other a-list guests, it'll give you credibility with sponsors. Good thing, if you have any sort of email list or automation on an email list or a drip or anything like that, I would add the episode with the dream guest to that drip. So I would make it so that anybody who ever joins my newsletter in the future will get emailed a link to listen to this episode because likely that person knows that dream guest. And so right away, you're like, hey, listen to my amazing podcast with this incredible person. That will get those people in the door to listen to more episodes. I would reshare the dream guest episode with my audience on social media regularly. So I would not only promote it the week that it comes out, but periodically forever more, I would republish that episode to my feed at minimum six months after it airs. But generally, you can do six to 12 or 18 months later, publish it again to get another credibility boost and put that name back to the top of your feed. I would then, after that guest is featured, research all the other podcasts that that dream guest has been on to do that. All you have to do is use a tool like listen notes. You could search that person's name and see all the podcast episodes that that person has appeared on. You can also simply use Apple podcasts and search that person's name. And if you sort by episodes, it'll show you in order of show size, generally, the other shows that that person has been on. And I would pitch myself to be a guest on all of the other shows that that dream guest has been on. Because I can say, hey, I see that you had dream guest. I just had dream guests on my show. Wasn't it great? Aren't they awesome? By the way, I noticed you haven't done an episode about my topic, any interest in doing so. And then I would, I aim to get myself and my show featured on those shows. So that's huge leverage in audience growth that doesn't rely on you begging that dream guest to share with their audience. And then finally, and the biggest lever that you can pull to improve your show is by asking the dream guest at the end of the interview, one extra question, which I've shared on this feed before, but it bears repeating. Ask them at the end, who do you think would be a great fit for this show? Who do you think would be a great fit for this show? What's going to happen is that person, if they had a good time, and if they thought you were good at interviewing them, and it was a good discussion, they're going to truly think about who, like them, would be a good fit for the show. And here's the thing. 95 times out of 100, the name that they come up with will be one of their peers. So another dream guest of yours. And it'll be someone who they know personally. And what's even better is that many times they will volunteer to put you in touch. So it'll be like this. Hey, person A, this was awesome. Who do you think would be a great fit for the show? Person A will stop the look up. They'll go, hmm, oh, have you considered person B? Meanwhile, in your head, you're like, yeah, I've totally considered person B. That would be awesome. But then, and you say that, you'd be like, oh my gosh, person B, that would be amazing. And a lot of times person A will be would say, oh, yeah, totally. I'd love to put you in contact. Can I, you know, would you like a connection? To which point you say, yes, please. And thank you. And then you offer to send them an email requesting the connection. So remember, make it easy. Every any time a dream guest tells you they're going to do something, you want to do everything in your power to make it easy for them to do that thing. And so if you were my dream guest and you said to me, Kevin, Kevin, I would love to put you in touch with person B. I said, I'll say awesome. I'll send you an email later today requesting a connection that you can just forward to them. And they're like, great. That way you aren't talking to you again, listener of Grow the Show. You're not the dream guest anymore, although maybe you are. Then you are not waiting for them to remember to connect you via email. You just send them an email and say, hey, person A, it was so great with talking with you earlier today. So thank you so much for the time. I'm just emailing to request the connection to person B as you suggested, as you suggested. Like we talked about person B, I really think person B would enjoy coming onto the show. They would be a great fit. My audience would love to hear them talk about XYZ. And so if you could be in contact, that would be amazing. Thank you again so much for the time sincerely, Kevin. And then what person A will do is they will reply to you and add person B to the thread and be like, yep, Kevin, great for talking. Person B, C seed here. Happy to introduce you to Kevin, an incredible podcaster who would love to have you on the show. And then boom, you got your next dream guest. Virtually all the dream guests that I've had on my shows have come through this never ending chain of asking each one who they recommend and then they make a connection. So that is in my opinion, the best way to maximize having dream guests is to turn them, flip them into even more dream guests. But hopefully today, I have given you plenty of ammo to truly get the most of featuring dream guests on your show. And if you are the podcaster again, who shared and grow the show, the Facebook group, your discontent, like I said, I want to encourage you that you got great results. It's rare to see downloads double over one episode. And so hopefully you appreciate that. And I appreciate you again for sharing your story with us. And everybody else, please get out there, pitch those dream guests, get one of them to say yes, turn that into a hundred more dream guests in your podcasting journey. And let us know in the grow the show, Facebook group, who you got. So thank you so much. My name is Kevin Schmidland. I am your podcast growth coach. And I will see you in the next episode.